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Continental Airlines Pilots File Lawsuit Against Union
Six former Continental Airlines pilots who now fly for United Airlines have filed a class-action lawsuit against their own union. The lawsuit claims that the Air Line Pilots Association,used a formula that unduly favored pilots from United Airlines when Continental merged with United in 2010 to form what was then the world’s largest airline. (www.frequentbusinesstraveler.com) Más...Sort type: [Top] [Newest]
I've thought that.
The collective bargaining agreements have severe increases that step up with seniority. At first, the increases could be borne with the increases in airline growth early in the industry growth cycle.
But eventually the insatiable desire for pay growth outgrew the ability of airlines to pay. So CBAs starting prividing higher pay for senior pilots at the expense of lower seniority (future) pilots.
These low-to-start but with much higher pay with years of seniority makes it difficult for pilots to easily move between airlines without a sever pay cut.
Most other professionals are paid based on their experience, and not based on seniority.
In many ways, CBAs have complicated pilots lives. Some may argue that these have gotten pilots better conditions that pilots would've gotten otherwise. But even benefits gotten from airlines past their ability to pay, by extorting employers with threats of walkouts, are later lost in rounds of bankruptcy.
Even the higher wages paid to more senior pilots have not only resulted in lower wages fir starting pilots, but have also pushed the airlines to embrace the regional airlines in order to reduce costs and be competitive with other airlines without these issues.
But like most professionals, pilot pay should more closely track their experience and abilities (based on which types flown and hours per type) and not just on years employed. Even worse years employed at only one airline.
It would be difficult to transition to such a system where pilots are paid more equitably, based on their own professional experience.
The unions and CBAs are fairly rigid in their treatment of wages. Pilots groups would not easily want to give up what they consider to be hard-fought gains.
Maybe in the future with increasing numbers of experienced ex-pats willing to return home, combined with pilot shortages may change starting pay offered to pilots, to reflect their experience.
The worst part of the CO pilots situation is that they're stuck. Despite all that was taken away, going to another airline means starting all over.
Can't tell you whether pilots would be willing to trade top pay for better conditions, like better starting pay and ability to more easily change between airlines if needed, without a severe drop in pay mid-career.
There are good arguments on both sides. But many pilots would've had much better professional and employment options without such a rigid system, not just the Continental pilots.
Some folks have long commutes after they've had to move for personal or family reasons. But changing airlines wasn't even an option because of these restrictive pay schemes.
It really is a shame for professionals to be treated like factory workers in the industrial age.
The collective bargaining agreements have severe increases that step up with seniority. At first, the increases could be borne with the increases in airline growth early in the industry growth cycle.
But eventually the insatiable desire for pay growth outgrew the ability of airlines to pay. So CBAs starting prividing higher pay for senior pilots at the expense of lower seniority (future) pilots.
These low-to-start but with much higher pay with years of seniority makes it difficult for pilots to easily move between airlines without a sever pay cut.
Most other professionals are paid based on their experience, and not based on seniority.
In many ways, CBAs have complicated pilots lives. Some may argue that these have gotten pilots better conditions that pilots would've gotten otherwise. But even benefits gotten from airlines past their ability to pay, by extorting employers with threats of walkouts, are later lost in rounds of bankruptcy.
Even the higher wages paid to more senior pilots have not only resulted in lower wages fir starting pilots, but have also pushed the airlines to embrace the regional airlines in order to reduce costs and be competitive with other airlines without these issues.
But like most professionals, pilot pay should more closely track their experience and abilities (based on which types flown and hours per type) and not just on years employed. Even worse years employed at only one airline.
It would be difficult to transition to such a system where pilots are paid more equitably, based on their own professional experience.
The unions and CBAs are fairly rigid in their treatment of wages. Pilots groups would not easily want to give up what they consider to be hard-fought gains.
Maybe in the future with increasing numbers of experienced ex-pats willing to return home, combined with pilot shortages may change starting pay offered to pilots, to reflect their experience.
The worst part of the CO pilots situation is that they're stuck. Despite all that was taken away, going to another airline means starting all over.
Can't tell you whether pilots would be willing to trade top pay for better conditions, like better starting pay and ability to more easily change between airlines if needed, without a severe drop in pay mid-career.
There are good arguments on both sides. But many pilots would've had much better professional and employment options without such a rigid system, not just the Continental pilots.
Some folks have long commutes after they've had to move for personal or family reasons. But changing airlines wasn't even an option because of these restrictive pay schemes.
It really is a shame for professionals to be treated like factory workers in the industrial age.
Labor unions.....BARF!
There is never a merger of equals. United was the 800 lb parakeet in the room, and picked over Continental like the stars of "Storage Wars."
The Union, ALPA, did not want to cede territory, so they fudged the seniority calculations for their benefit so the greater number of pilots from the United side would feel the warm fuzzies toward retaining the ALPA.
The Courts will hopefully provide equitable relief for the shabby treatment former Continental pilots have received from those with a fiduciary duty to look after their interests.
The economic loss suffered by the Continental pilots cannot be replaced with the entire assets of the ALPA, so perhaps they should be shut down and allow a new entity to represent all pilots of the combined companies on an equal footing.
The Union, ALPA, did not want to cede territory, so they fudged the seniority calculations for their benefit so the greater number of pilots from the United side would feel the warm fuzzies toward retaining the ALPA.
The Courts will hopefully provide equitable relief for the shabby treatment former Continental pilots have received from those with a fiduciary duty to look after their interests.
The economic loss suffered by the Continental pilots cannot be replaced with the entire assets of the ALPA, so perhaps they should be shut down and allow a new entity to represent all pilots of the combined companies on an equal footing.
You really think that Moak and crew are gonna lay down, roll over and give this up without a fight, especially with such a pro labor administration. He pretty much already has but Moak is coming to point where he is a UAL pilot or Union President.
Moak is a DAL pilot
I'll take your word for it. Previous media articles stated he was UAL. It don't matter. He still needs to make a choice.
The American public does not understand or care that the perceived highly paid pilots doing what they love to do have a squawk with their airline. Just saying, its time that ALPA and other self interest organizations be banned as the primary representation since they never seem to make both sides happy..